Is Joker: Folie à Deux a Musical? Not According to Its Stars (But It Probably Is)

Joker: Folie à Deux — the sequel to Todd Phillips’s film Joker — has premiered at the Venice Film Festival, and its cast and creative team are trying to talk their way out of calling the new movie a musical.

“I wouldn’t necessarily say this is a musical in a lot of ways,” co-star Lady Gaga, who plays Harleen “Lee” Quinel (also known as Harley Quinn), said during a press conference. “The way that music is used is to really give the characters a way to express what they need to say because the scene and just the dialogue is not enough.”

So, in other words, as anyone who has seen a musical can tell you, it’s a musical, right?

Still no, according to writer and director Phillips, reiterating the same talking point in Variety. “It’s just Arthur [Joaquin Phoenix’s character] not having the words to say what he wants to say, so he sings them instead.”

And while Phoenix and Phillips had originally discussed the possibility of doing a show on Broadway, or even at the Carlyle (they weren’t interested), in the same interview, Phillips says that they took very special care to make sure that it wasn’t like the film adaptation of In the Heights, “where the lady in the bodega starts to sing and they take it out onto the street, and the police are dancing.”

And it even has showtunes: “That’s Entertainment” from The Band Wagon. “Bewitched, Bothered and Bewildered” from Pal Joey. “If My Friends Could See Me Now” from Sweet Charity. “Gonna Build a Mountain” from Stop the World — I Want to Get Off.

So, it’s not a musical. And labeling it that way would risk turning off the target demographic for Joker, disaffected heterosexual men, most of whom wouldn’t be caught dead at a musical.

But that’s exactly what it is.